Un&*^%$ real

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Un&*^%$ real

Postby Pool Man » Mon Oct 27, 2008 4:40 pm

This weekend we went through 4-5 starters and 2 flywheels. The starter grinds like crazy and the bendix continuously kicks in and out. Any ideas as to what is causing the problem or what we can try and do to help with the problem. We have had this problem with every 168 tooth starter and flex plate. We have been running a 139 tooth sprocket flex plate with 0 problems. Was forced to go with a 168 tooth again because CSR does not make a 139 tooth external balanced flex plate. They only make internal balance plates with 139. Please someone smiley-help .
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Postby 3dracing » Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:25 am

That is what I had on it wasa CSR starter. Take an amprobe and check the amps on the starter wire when you are turning the motor over. We had one do that and put Ford solenoid on it and it fixed the problem. Also call Rowland and get the clearance between the pinion and flexplate.
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Postby ppm » Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:12 am

That is what I was going to say, you might need to shim the starter
sounds like it is not engaging all the way in the flywheel.

Hey Steve how is everyone doing in your neck of the woods?

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Postby 3dracing » Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:56 am

Doing good how about you?
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Postby Pool Man » Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:46 pm

Been there done that already. Will check for voltage drop tonight. I have taken enough starters apart from this weekend to fell comfortable changing the gears now. That is what i am in the process of doing now. Will have the gears tomorrow. Plan on putting one on the CSR starter and see what happens.
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Postby RacerDude2123 » Tue Oct 28, 2008 5:12 pm

our friends started kept doing the same thing... switched to powermaster like we run and had no problems
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Postby 3dracing » Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:42 am

A couple other things I thought about. Do you have a timing retard on it for cranking? I have found the small motors crank better when you use one. Also is the block grounded to the chassis and if it is, isthe wire big enough and is the ground a good one?
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Postby Pool Man » Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:51 am

Steve, we have the paint removed from under the engine cradles for grounding. We have run a retarder before but Brian said it made the engine miss. Not sure if it did or not. I want to talk him into putting it back on. I moved the car out of the trailer yesterday. I poured a few ounces of gas down the intake prior to starting. As soon as i hit the ignition the engine fired right up. We have a aux. gas tank and pump we are going to put on it to see if that helps.
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Postby SideWinder » Wed Oct 29, 2008 2:32 pm

Ron

Two years ago we had the same issue with our BBC kicking back and breaking the teeth off the flywheel. In fact, I have a very impressive collection of 166/167 tooth flywheels!!

What we did to correct the problem was....

1. Switch to a Powermaster starter (Ultra Torque 9400)

2. Rewire the car with 2-0 cables. Yes, 2-0 cables smiley-embarassed . They're about the size of a 3/4 inch garden hose, maybe larger. No problem getting 12 plus volts to the starter. I have one running all the way from the battery to the starter and one is a ground running all the way from the battery to the block. The positive does go thru a kill switch.

We run the MSD 7AL3 but do not use the auto retard. It starts much better without the auto retard.

The 2-0 cables may be a bit of overkill but they work very well. If my memory serves me well, Powermaster recommends 1-0 cables if they are over 10' long. In my dragster, they are just a hair over 10'.

It started everytime this summer without one single problem!!
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Postby TS403C » Wed Oct 29, 2008 4:05 pm

I had a that problem last year. Changed 3 different flexplates and 2 starters. My cure was that I installed a 16v battery called The Rock. That battery spins my 622 over like I left out the spark plugs and fires right up.
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Postby Pool Man » Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:02 pm

I am starting to think we have a low voltage problem. In wayof a weak battery. Will put a new battery in and see what happens. I also changed the pinion gear on the CSR starter and will install it also. Have thought abt. a larger capacity starting system also.
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Postby Mindbenders5 » Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:16 pm

Do you get the car spinning over and then hit the starter switch?
Try an optima battery. I ran 2 in my chevyII and they work great. I dont know what kind of car you have but if it stands up at all the plates in a regular battery can hit each other and short out. and this will cause a drop in voltage too.
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Postby Pool Man » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:04 pm

We do turn the engine over prior to hitting the ignition swithch. No wheelies. Well, not big ones. This weekend the front tires were abt. 6" off the ground. We run a dragster.
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Postby Mindbenders5 » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:56 pm

Oh ok. Well just a thought.
I have a 67 chevy II that leaves a little higher than that!
But it probably goes a lot slower than you do!
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Postby 3dracing » Thu Oct 30, 2008 3:35 pm

Yeah Ron, I was going to tell you to check for voltage drop while you spun it over also.
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Postby drags3078 » Sat Nov 08, 2008 12:18 am

Ron hook your voltmeter up to the battery and have him crank it over .... the battery should not fall below 10 volts while cranking for up to 15 seconds .... if it does fall below 10 volt then you have either weak battery system OR a starter thats drawing too many amps from the battery ..... too me it sounds like a low battery problem .... at the shop I check starter amp draw and battery voltage at the same time while cranking
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Postby Pool Man » Sat Nov 08, 2008 9:52 am

Yea, we just bought a new battery. Still not real pleased with the way the starter sounds. WIll mess around with shims another time i guess. Thanks guys.
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Postby 3945JrDad » Sat Nov 08, 2008 11:09 am

I think Gus is on to something check your wire size, and connections for oxidation.
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Postby 1hotheadracing » Sat Dec 27, 2008 11:05 pm

poolman it does sound like wire or ground problem,at my shop i get alot of cars that the owners say they need a new starter our battery and then when i ttell them it was a wire or bad ground they dont believe me until they see its fixed.the wires can have a high resitince and make the volts drop down big time that the starter gets.hope that helps.
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Postby Pool Man » Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:51 am

How do you check the wire?
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